204Ruger

There are a couple of us that should have some good chrono data in the next few weeks. I'm working on 2 boxes of 35 Bergers, I'll be shooting both coated and naked of the same loads. I'm hoping to shoot naked (bullets) this Saturday, and coated on Sunday.

I will be anxiously awaiting your results. If there is a significant improvement in velocity between naked and coated bullets, that will be good enough for me!

Well my kid brother said I got 1# of WS2 in the mail yesterday so it looks like I have enough for a while. Won't be able to get to try any out until January though

MinotBob--I understand you received a whole pound of WS2 in the mail just the other day, so maybe this is too late, but I'll put it in here anyway. That one pound of WS2 may well be enough to coat an entire automobile!!!!

To answer your question about what the particle size of the WS2 WrzWaldo said he was using to coat bullets, here's a quote from the very first post in this thread from WrzWaldo's own words about the size of the WS2 particles (color and bolding added by me):

I can buy the bullets and coat/send them or you can send me the bullets you want coated. I am limiting this to 17/20 calibers right now and in lots of 50. Coating will be with .6 micron WS2.

Yep I'm using .6 micron, that should be about 0.000023622"...

WW

I've said this before, but after using WS2 now for about 5 years, and coating literally thousands of bullets, I'm still using my original 4 oz tub of the stuff!

I'm coating 17, 20, 22, 6mm, 277, 308, and .338 bullets with it too. The stuff appears to last forever.....Bob, Silverfox may be right, you could coat your truck with a full pound!

Silverfox wrote:MinotBob--I understand you received a whole pound of WS2 in the mail just the other day, so maybe this is too late, but I'll put it in here anyway. That one pound of WS2 may well be enough to coat an entire automobile!!!!

To answer your question about what the particle size of the WS2 WrzWaldo said he was using to coat bullets, here's a quote from the very first post in this thread from WrzWaldo's own words about the size of the WS2 particles (color and bolding added by me):

I can buy the bullets and coat/send them or you can send me the bullets you want coated. I am limiting this to 17/20 calibers right now and in lots of 50. Coating will be with .6 micron WS2.

Thanks Silverfox. I figgered that out just after I asked. Anyway the 1# was $45 from a Canadian outfit and I figgered that we can use this for more conventional lubricant uses also. I wonder if it would improve the gas mileage on my 7.4L Suburban? It's already gray so.... Naw too many BB's.

204Shooter--I don't think the test results are going to show a "significant improvement in velocity between naked and coated bullets" as you mentioned in your last post, if you were thinking the coated bullets would fly faster than the bare bullets. Maybe I don't understand what you meant by the statement below

I will be anxiously awaiting your results. If there is a significant improvement in velocity between naked and coated bullets, that will be good enough for me!

I am quite certain you will find just the opposite. The application of Danzac (WS2 also called tungsten disulphide), IMHO will cause a decrease in velocity if you are using the same powder charge with the coated bullets and the bare bullets. I found that to be true when I did limited testing with moly a long, long, long time ago.

Today, I did a very limited test with some of the 27.8 gr. Hammett bullets I coated for my .17 Remington. My muzzle velocity with these 27.8 gr. Hammett bullets without any coating has been right in the 3,990 to 4,000 fps range. I only had 8 of the coated bullets loaded up for today's test, so it isn't a BIG sampling, but the first four shots (out of a cold, clean barrel that had been treated with a 20% Danzac/80% alcohol wet patch) averaged 3,708 fps at 12 feet from the muzzle. The first shot out of the barrel was WAAAAAY off to the left. Like I said, this is the load I have been shooting prairie dogs with using bare bullets this summer and had the scope set for a tad over 1 inch high at 100 yards. The next three shots came back to the right a bit and were much better for height, but still way left.



To keep this post in the .204 Ruger vein, I let the rifle cool down while I shot some of my 39 gr. Sierra loads from my Savage 12VLP to get my scope adjusted for coyote season. I shot the first four shots, with shot #1 coming from a freshly cleaned and cold barrel. Shots 2, 3, and 4 were a wee bit lower than I like. I prefer my 39 gr. Sierras to hit about 1 inch high at 100 yards, so I cranked up one click on my Leupold VX-III 6.5-20x40mm long range elevation knob and settled in and fired shot #5. It hit just a tad above 1 inch high and pretty close to the money horizontally so I ejected the spent shell, closed the bolt and put the rifle back in the case. I think I ready for coyotes now



The scope I have on my Pac-Nor barreled .17 Remington is a Sightron II 6.5-20x50mm and it has 1/4" adjustment clicks. So, before I shot my last four shots, I did one click down and five clicks right. There was a 10+ mph wind blowing from my left to my right when I shot this last group. My average velocity at 12 feet from the muzzle was up at 3,788 fps when I shot the last four shots of the Danzac coated 27.8 gr. Hammett bullets. Here's the second 4-shot group and YES, I wiggled severly on shot #2, but that's life.



Like I said, this is not a very big sampling, but there definitely was a HUGE difference in velocity noted from what I had been getting with bare bullets and what I was now getting with the Danzac coated bullets using the exact same powder charge. I might add too, that I used the same primers, same seating depth, etc., etc. I will definitely be trying some heavier powder charges with these coated bullets.

As a matter of fact I have a bunch all ready to go right now. Also, I shot five of my 25 gr. Hornady hollowpoint loads with bare bullets after I shot the 8 shots with the Danzac bullets. The 25 gr. Hornady load has been averaging 4,030 fps at 12 feet from the muzzle and today it averaged only 3,902 fps. I think that Dazac is slicker than owl $hit.

The load I was using with the bare 27.8 gr. Hammetts and the coated bullets was 24.8 gr. of N-540. I have loaded up some test loads with N-549 at 25.0 gr., 25.1 gr., 25.2 gr., 25.3 gr., and 25.4 gr. Yes, those are only .1 gr. increments, but I want to go poco a poco and not blow myself up If the wind ever goes down again, I'll be out at the rifle range doing some more testing.

I have to agree with Rick in Oregon about ease of cleaning the barrel. Yes, I only shot 13 shots before I cleaned, but when I used SLIP 2000 to get the carbon and powder residue out, I did get a wee bit of copper. I got virtually no copper on my patches when I used my copper cleaning solvent. So, I neutralized the bore and ran a patch down the bore using Rick in Oregon's recipe of 20% Danzac and 80% alcohol mixed together to prep the barrel for my next range trip.

Like I said, this is not a very big sampling, but there definitely was a HUGE difference in velocity noted from what I had been getting with bare bullets and what I was now getting with the Danzac coated bullets using the exact same powder charge. I might add too, that I used the same primers, same seating depth, etc., etc. I will definitely be trying some heavier powder charges with these coated bullets.

Yep that's about how it goes, pressure goes down and velocity goes down. You will be able to pick the velocity back up with load development for the coated bullets.

Another good use for Danzac that I have found is to put a little dab on the sear surface of your trigger. I put some on my Cooper trigger and with not other adjustments it feels like a much better trigger. It may be in my mind, but it sure seems to pull easier. I just coated 200 17 cal Vmax and 100 Berger 35's with it. Will try and get out to do some load testing when the wind dies down a bit.

Phasor

Another thing I use it for...

Mix a little with high pressure/temp grease and use on bolt lugs. Mine are now smooth as silk!

I wonder how that would be mixed with 7-up. Acloco, have you tried that?

I've coated the entire inside of my bolts with dry WS2. Degreased all the parts and used a small paint brush. A very very light coat of oil after cleaning eases application.
No longer need to worry as much about gunk build up inside. After disassembling a bolt from a used gun purchase and seeing all the sludge inside I did all my guns this way.

Yep trigger sears and all pivot points treated as well.
I even went so far as to use my finger to apply it dry to the outside of my bolt, lugs and raceways. Works great but must be occasionally reapplied although with less and less frequency.
Sure makes your finger silver though. There seems to be just enough oil on the finger to make it adhere well.
It does make a stainless bolt look dirty but oh so smooth.

A million and one uses.

As for velocity yes its just like moly (only better) Velocity will go down substantially with a given powder charge. The bright side is velocity will rise faster than the pressure which allows you to acheive even higher velocity compared to naked bullets.
Although I haven't done it I know that using Viht 135 and WS2 coated 40gn Bergers I could push them past 4000 fps. Thats not bad now is it.
Disclaimer Dont just rush out and try that though. Lots of little differences between my gun/brass and yours could create a very dangerous load.

Hotshot wrote:I wonder how that would be mixed with 7-up. Acloco, have you tried that?

I had the flu for 3.5 days last week...if THAT is what you are referring to!

NOT fun!

I know that Moly can be corrosive in a humid environment, but what about WS2? Anyone have any data to say it's not? Just wondering if it's ok to pre-treat the barrel after cleaning and put it away for next time or if you should pre-treat just before shooting?

From my experience on this: Clean, bare steel barrel lightly coated with protective oil for storage, pre-treat with 20%/80% WS2-denatured alcohol prior to shooting.

This method does not allow any moisture to get in under the coating of WS2 during storage. After using this method for almost ten years, virtually zero signs of any rust or corrosion from moisture in any of my barrels.